Kickas.org Forums Ankylosing Spondylitis General Discussion #1 AS Web Support Group My letter to the Dalai Lama

Hi All,
It is quite interseting to see, that when one falls in pain and loses control, he/she turn to divine or mystical forces at work! Glad to see I am not the only one

Firstly, I love this discussion. I accept and am trying to "Acceptance" to AS + life situations. Yes karma has a role, yes it is probably not fair to bear bad karma from past lives, but I dont complain when I get rewards from good karmas. I have a wonderful finace, great family, stable and secure life.

I strongly believe that any autoimmune disease is our body's way of telling that we are suppressing a part of our feelings/needs/duties. It our body's way of syaing "listen to me you idiot". Recently,I got some help in guided meditations and realised, or got aware, of a variety of factors. I will share some details, I realised that i blamed my father for not spending enough time with me when I was a kid. He passed away when I was 13yrs old. I realised that I need to get back to my spirtiual path, that I left 5 years ago, that is before AS. Realised I am carrying a bad karma for few more things.
I am trying to work on these things now, even if they dont help me with AS, these atleast would calm my spirit.

I am still quite frustated and blame the almighty power (whoever it is, whatever religion) for not giving us mortal beings enough will to control our minds, our desirer and clear 5 bullet point plan to avoid pain

All I need is enough courage to carry through this life, be a good man, good husband, good father and smell some roses on the way.

Hi Ansh,

Welcome to KA - sorry you *had* to find this place, but you won't regret your journey here.

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I am still quite frustrated and blame the almighty power (whoever it is, whatever religion) for not giving us mortal beings enough will to control our minds, our desires and clear 5 bullet point plan to avoid pain

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Isn't that *why* we're here? To discover this stuff (in this rebirth, or the next, or the next....)???

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All I need is enough courage to carry through this life, be a good man, good husband, good father and smell some roses on the way.

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And that, my friend is indeed an honourable place to start!

Louise

I found myself going back to the Tao as I read some of the recent posts. I, too, explored ideas from Buddhism and other eastern religions when I was younger. I think there is/was a drive to do this in the West - perhaps a disatisfaction/rejection of western philosophy, maybe from disappointment?

Anyway, Taoism was and is the only Eastern philosophy that really "spoke" to me. On this forum, I have so far been very cautious about indicating my current religious/philosophical views because I realize they may be at odds with many others whose friendships I am beginning to treasure. Suffice it to say that I am a "recovering" religious person.

Anyway, back to the Tao. Interestingly, I suspect many who deal with AS so effectively on this forum, people like stevec, alan, brad who have been forced to deal with AS at is worst and yet continue to demonstrate such a warm, humorous and positive outlook, are living the message of the Tao:

"Accept misfortune as the human condition.

What do you mean by "Accept misfortune as the human condition"?
Misfortune comes from having a body.
Without a body, how could there be misfortune?

Surrender yourself humbly; then you can be trusted to care for all things.

Tao abides in non-action,
Yet nothing is left undone.
If kings and lords observed this,
The ten thousand things would develop naturally.
If they still desired to act,
They would return to the simplicity of formless substance.
Without form, there is no desire.
Without desire there is tranquillity.
And in this way all things would be at peace.

In the pursuit of learning, every day something is acquired.
In the pursuit of the Tao, every day something is dropped.

Less and less is done
Until non-action is achieved.
When nothing is done, nothing is left undone.

The world is ruled by letting things take their course.
It cannot be ruled by interfering.

It is not wise to rush about.
Controlling the breath causes strain.
If too much energy is used, exhaustion follows.
This is not the way of the Tao.
Whatever is contrary to the Tao will not last long."

These are various versus from the Tao Te Ching - they are not contiguous. The Tao is inactive, but gets everything done. It is empty but everything comes from it. The Tao is natural and unaffected; it is simple and spontaneous.

When faced with a life-altering disease, I can think of no other way to deal with it. The taoist principle that appeals to me most is Wu Wei or Effortless Action, something we can learn by watching water. A stream doesn't struggle to get past rocks and boulders in its path - it doesn't fight them - it just goes around with effortless action, singing as it goes.

The more I fight this disease, the more exhausted I feel but that doesn't mean I'm going to lie down and give up. As many of you know, I have continued to work on and, finally, as of last night, completed my thesis and will now get my MBA. Looking back, I have no idea how I managed the last residency (when I met Chris) - it was step by step just taking things as they came and trying not to panic. By the time I saw Chris, I had been on prednisone for nearly a week and was walking and moving better, but the first two weeks was a minute by minute process. For example, I had to plug the kettle in the night before because I couldn't make a cup of tea in the morning otherwise - my hands were too painful and locked like claws until I had time to loosen them up. I just did what I have to do - and none of it was due to positive thinking. It was much more wu wei - can't do the kettle in the morning - do it the night before. However, none of this is a passive approach - it certainly doesn't mean giving up - wu wei includes action but it's not raging action or fighting to win through (while the ambulances stand by) -it's that gentle, effortless action that includes humour and good grace, as practiced by steve, alan and brad.

Interesting discussion. I also studied Buddhist thought many years ago.

I would go back to the very beginning of the story. Siddhartha sat down under the tree because he was overwhelmed with seeing real suffering for the first time in his life (rich/overprotected kid). He was determined to find the end for suffering. His solution (not having a better one at the time), was to end all desire. Unfortunately, Siddhartha's solution became yet another one of mankind's attempts to earn a way out of suffering. You must WORK at ridding yourself of desire. ALL desire. Who has ever done this? Even the Buddha desired to end desire. It's a contradiction.

The only person in history who ever truly ridded himself of desire lived 600 years later - Christ. His one desire (because the ultimate reality is that you must have one) was to do the will of his Father. So, instead of desiring to rid himself of suffering, he went through ultimate suffering to save not himself, but us from suffering. After thousands of years, we've pretty much proved our inability to end our desires and suffering. Look at the massive amount of suffering today. Our path to enlightenment surely doesn't seem to be progressive. While the Buddha said, "Don't look to me, look to the Way," Christ made the shocking statement, "I AM the Way." This also makes Christ's odd statement about suffering clear:

Disciples: "Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he was born blind?" (Karma)
Christ: "Neither this man nor his parents sinned, but this happened so that the work of God might be displayed in his life."

No, I'm not instantly healed from my earthly suffering, but I do have the promise that Christ will work all of it - every terrible moment I have - for the glory of God.

"He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away."

I'm looking forward to it.

I am also looking forward to it!

That was beautiful Wendy, this conversation is getting more and more amazing. When I'm feeling bitter and suspect that I might need to blunt my sharp tongue, I think about our three amigos too (Steve,Alan and Brad).

Here's a quote you might like:

"Tigger is all right really," said Piglet lazily.
"Of course he is," said Christopher Robin.
"Everybody is really," said Pooh. "That's what I think," said Pooh.
"But I don't suppose I'm right," he said.
"Of course you are," said Christopher Robin.

This is from the Tao of Pooh, of course.

Chris

I love how we can come together to discuss matters of faith and spirituality and leave our judgements at the door. After all faith is just a belief and beliefs are deeply personal, no matter how powerful a person's faith might be it is ultimately that person's choice as to what they will believe.

Of course culture and family ties factor into these choices to greater and lesser degrees but in the end, each of us has to make that choice for ourselves if we are truly honest about our search for truth.

I'm very impressed with our community, and I am reminded of one of Wendy's comments about how the world would benefit by following our example.

Wouldn't it be wonderful if this could develop into a discussion of all faiths and philosophies without the typical sort of problems that arise in such conversations?

There are so many of us from so many parts of this world that the potential for giving and sharing "our truths" is staggering - of course, the converse of this is also true.

Thanks for sharing, I hope many others come in and do the same.

Chris

Congratulations for coming out of the closet Ansh

Your comments are valued and add something important to this discussion. Whether I agree with everything you said or not, I value your contribution and offer you thanks.

One thing is for sure, the course of this discussion thus far is renewing my faith in humanity.

Chris

Yes, I love that quote, Chris.

Not surprisingly, Chris, I have a copy of the Tao of Pooh as well as the Te of Piglet (which I actually like better) and a very nice 25th anniversary edition of the translation of Tao Te Ching by Gia-Fu Feng and Jane English - which I used for the verses that I posted.

I've enjoyed this thread a lot, beginning with your letter and then laughing my a$$ off at Salvadore's response!